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edited July 2016 in Miscellaneous
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  • I fully agree with his comments on the jingo brigade on the shouting-heads shows. But, I don't really think that this comment is in line with what he represents being in the post that he is. It sounds a tad political.
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  • Any more links of his statements expressing similar ideas? Just curious.
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  • media shouldn't have compared him with the terrorist. It will hurt anyone who is at the same position.
    wind power α v^3. That's how speed matters to generate power required to drive upsc exam.
  • ^^ The guy writes rather well. :)
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  • media shouldn't have compared him with the terrorist. It will hurt anyone who is at the same position.

    Yes. That's absolutely undeniable. The biggest threats to peace in this country includes a good chunk of the Indian media.
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  • Yes, which is why his thoughts reflect more clearly. :D

    :D
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  • I hav already stated multiple times.giving a jhunjuna of good rank in upsc to kashmiri elite and hoping to imbibe kashmiris in Indian mainstram is fatal hope.
    Kashmiri youngesters have so much of energy n enough rbcs content dey must b trained in a manner to bring gold in olympics .Dis will only bring nationalism and will make use of their discrete energy in constructive manner.
  • I agree with @DrKingSchultz . His statement (from NDTV) - While Kashmir was "mourning its dead, the propaganda and provocation being dished out from red and blue newsrooms is breeding more alienation and anger in Kashmir than what (the) Indian state can manage," he said in his Facebook post. smacks of separatist mentality. Better that such officers remain in valley alone.

  • edited July 2016
    ^^ I guess he's just as frustrated as any other youth in Kashmir. The state is in omnishambles; violence has been a constant part of life; opportunities are limited; freedoms are restricted - all in national interest, but it does take a toll on the people actually living through it. One may beg to interject and remind us all that Kashmir is within the ambit of our definition of 'nation.' The point being made is valid, when he says, "State killing its own citizens self-decimation of worst sort." But I don't think that this is expected of a serving officer of the government to critisise government action, which he could be doing rather tepidly (or not).
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  • ^^ Exactly.
    Nobody is denying the spiralling violence that is the norm in the valley.
    But instead of denouncing the militants and speaking out against Pakistan as a true Indian and an officer of the Indian government should, he gives legitimacy to the militancy by subtly implicating the Indian Army for the current predicament of the Valley.
    Such statements are unacceptable and he should be careful of what he speaks as a civil servant.

    Sums it up.
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  • @Etat It is not as if the government is hell-bent on violence. All their actions so far have been to counter the violence started by kashmiris in solidarity with a terrorist. It is not without reason that the valley gets 8x the amount they contribute towards administration.

    They value 'azzadi' rubbish more than growth and development.

  • AFSPA needs to go. 25 years to too long for a failed experiment to go on without a review.
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  • edited July 2016
    Given that people in jammu and ladakh/leh are routinely held hostage to the dramas by kashmiris, things have to improve a lot to warrant afspa removal.

    There are others too in that state whose interests have to be cared for.
  • Removal is imperative to remove the excuse of throwing stones every Friday evening after a prayer-visit to the local mosque.

    Risking an allegation of oversimplification, I would go out on a limb to say that, AFSPA is the only thing that separates the youth of Kashmir from those of, say, Himachal or MP, all other problems like corruption, unemployment, education (lack of) etc being the same. Some may nitpick of course.
    A Lion doesn't concern himself with the opinions of the sheep.
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  • edited July 2016
    And adding to my previous post about jammu/leh, remving afspa at this time or in near future will be the worst possible decision. It will like rewarding the kashmiris for their constant violence and will end up encouraging further violence to fulfill their other demands. Their community leaders will have to work a lot with the authorities towards that eventuality.
  • edited July 2016
    AFSPA needs to go but it's way too premature to withdraw it at this juncture. The need for AFSPA should end with the need for the army to remain posted. The latter is at the other end of a tunnel that we're going through without even a glimpse of light ahead. AFSPA is a serious problem for those living under it. They're sick of it. But the alternative is worsening terrorism and basically doing exactly what the enemies want. AFSPA is essential at this stage to keep terrorism in check. But of course, excesses must be dealt with fairly. The problem with this approach is that nobody agrees upon the definition of fairness.
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  • Removal is imperative to remove the excuse of throwing stones every Friday evening after a prayer-visit to the local mosque.

    Risking an allegation of oversimplification, I would go out on a limb to say that, AFSPA is the only thing that separates the youth of Kashmir from those of, say, Himachal or MP, all other problems like corruption, unemployment, education (lack of) etc being the same. Some may nitpick of course.

    Peene walon ko peene ka bahana chahiye. After AFSPA, it'll be something else; after that, something else. The issue is proxy war under the garb of a national movement. There's nothing short of handing Kashmir to Pakistan that would stop the stone pelters, not even 'Azaadi.' Even a hypothetical 'Azaad' Kashmiri nation would face similar attacks till they're 'reunited with their brothers in Pakistan.' It's all a Paki game. India shouldn't fall for it. We should stop pussyfooting on stern action against antinationals. Cancer needs surgery.
    Prelims : 2/5; Mains : 0/2; Interview : 0; Remainder : 1+1 (Tired but not; Retired) / Medical Science / Kolkata / Nihilist extraordinaire | Thanks a lot...
  • There is almost no government in J&K, there has never actually been. The elections in India do give some sense of belonging or having a share in the state. But genuine electioneering has had a very short time in J&K.

    And


    such an image reflects what sort of gloom and anger may be slithering.

    At this hour the J&K government should be the ideal rescuer but the competency and influence of this 'jammu-kashmir' alliance is very doubtful. The memory of these episodes may linger on people's minds and for no good reason, except perpetuating gloom.

    As far as Shah Faisal is concerned he certainly doesn't want to be highlighted as a counter-point to militancy, and risk his safety.
    तदबीर से बिगड़ी हुई तक़दीर बना ले, अपने पे भरोसा है तो एक दाँव लगा ले।
  • why to keep a leg wounded by a scorpion bite (read azaadi ka keeda)..why not get it separated from the body instead..operating it again and again aint working, zeher to badhta hi ja raha hai..
    also, why not give an option of referendum to kashmiris like scotland got..?
    the 1st argument that comes up when kashmir's independence is thought of is that it would create a serious security problem for the plains..so we keep kashmir as a buffer state, just to protect us..??

    Burhan Wani is a sachcha terrorist, killing people indiscriminately even after dying..
    AIR-128. CSE-2016.
    IRS IT.
  • I don't get what message the above photos want to convey? That army is torturing/brutalizing the innocent kashmiris or what?

    But no one conveys the fact that everywhere in india, whether police, paramilitary or military, pellets are fired below the knee level. But now if you are busy picking up stones to throw them at the forces and get hit by the pellets, it's not the responsibility of the authorities. Remain at your home when curfew has been imposed to maintain law and order.
  • kashmir can be saved only if pakistan is destroyed because the disturbances are inspired mostly from outside..... >:)
    wind power α v^3. That's how speed matters to generate power required to drive upsc exam.
  • edited July 2016
    @TAR If this is your prescription to deal with the enemy of the nations, we will lose before even making any attempt to fight them off. We gave up SC seat for china, kennedy offered to test a nuclear bomb for us ahead of china in the 60's (we would not be struggling for nsg seat today if that test would have occurred.

    All these efforts to cultivate friendly relations with china have yielded us what exactly?

    And similar situation is developing in bengal. How do you plan to deal with that?
  • My mention of AFSPA seems to have digressed this thread. Wasn't this about Faesal vs Wani.
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  • TARTAR
    edited July 2016
    scorpio50 said:

    @TAR If this is your prescription to deal with the enemy of the nations, we will lose before even making any attempt to fight them off. We gave up SC seat for china, kennedy offered to test a nuclear bomb for us ahead of china in the 60's (we would not be struggling for nsg seat today if that test would have occurred.

    All these efforts to cultivate friendly relations with china have yielded us what exactly?

    you really think its only pakistan behind all this or you think kashmiris are the enemies of the nation..??
    if pakistan is the inspiration for most of them, then let them make their choice..if we have not kept them forcefully with us, then why be afraid of a referendum...they wont vote out.
    believe it or not, kashmir doesnt want to be a part of India and if despite of all our efforts(which most people think the state has made) if we are not able to keep them siding us, then its our fault not of pakistan..
    AIR-128. CSE-2016.
    IRS IT.
  • Etat said:

    Removal is imperative to remove the excuse of throwing stones every Friday evening after a prayer-visit to the local mosque.

    Risking an allegation of oversimplification, I would go out on a limb to say that, AFSPA is the only thing that separates the youth of Kashmir from those of, say, Himachal or MP, all other problems like corruption, unemployment, education (lack of) etc being the same. Some may nitpick of course.

    Peene walon ko peene ka bahana chahiye. After AFSPA, it'll be something else; after that, something else. The issue is proxy war under the garb of a national movement. There's nothing short of handing Kashmir to Pakistan that would stop the stone pelters, not even 'Azaadi.' Even a hypothetical 'Azaad' Kashmiri nation would face similar attacks till they're 'reunited with their brothers in Pakistan.' It's all a Paki game. India shouldn't fall for it. We should stop pussyfooting on stern action against antinationals. Cancer needs surgery.
    Insurgency was at its worst in Punjab, at one time. In 1992-93, new Government came into power and there was a political will to curb militancy. Punjab Police was given free hand under KPS Gill. Within 2 years militancy waned. There were gross Human Rights Violations. It is inevitable. The CM paid price when he was killed by suicide bombers in 1995. But at least normalcy returned.

    Another aspect is that while terrorists were dealt with an iron fist within Punjab, there were covert operations in Pakistan as well, conducted by RAW. There was a tit-for-tat response to every terrorist incident in Punjab. The costs seemed too high to Pakistan to continue this proxy war and eventually they had to reduce their support to terrorism in Punjab.

    Unfortunately, this covert infrastructure of RAW, which took years to build, was dismantled by IK Gujral. Else the RAW agents could have used similar tactics in Pakistan now.
    Perhaps we can still use this strategy, but it will take a lot of time to develop assets.
    Rake up unrest in Baluchistan, and give indirect hint to Pakistan at whose behest is this happening. You trouble Kashmir, we will trouble Baluchistan.

    Pakistan knows only one language. Tit for tat. Bleed them with thousand cuts and they'll stop troubling Kashmir.
    जो उखाड़ना है उखाड़ लो.
  • kashmir can be saved only if pakistan is destroyed because the disturbances are inspired mostly from outside..... >:)

    kashmir can be saved only if pakistan is destroyed because the disturbances are inspired mostly from outside..... >:)

    such a scenario may reduce the intensity perhaps but we can't be sure that trouble will end. There is no pakistan across Nagaland, but there is still demand for special considerations.
    Punjab's sepratism moderated and the expectation of growth and prosperity played a major role, no doubt along with strong police action. But still the bottomline remains that there need to be resolve from within the troubled region to wrest peace. This internal resolve to wrest peace is lacking. Solely with army's strength present situation may be continued, but it will be for no better end. Democracy in J&K stands questioned here, it's a case of polarized state reflected in the coalition government itself. May be the answer could be in breaking the coalition, and hold fresh elections in due time. Let people vent out their frustration with the present government.
    तदबीर से बिगड़ी हुई तक़दीर बना ले, अपने पे भरोसा है तो एक दाँव लगा ले।
  • TAR said:

    scorpio50 said:

    @TAR If this is your prescription to deal with the enemy of the nations, we will lose before even making any attempt to fight them off. We gave up SC seat for china, kennedy offered to test a nuclear bomb for us ahead of china in the 60's (we would not be struggling for nsg seat today if that test would have occurred.

    All these efforts to cultivate friendly relations with china have yielded us what exactly?

    you really think its only pakistan behind all this or you think kashmiris are the enemies of the nation..??
    if pakistan is the inspiration for most of them, then let them make their choice..if we have not kept them forcefully with us, then why be afraid of a referendum...they wont vote out.
    believe it or not, kashmir doesnt want to be a part of India and if despite of all our efforts(which most people think the state has made) if we are not able to keep them siding us, then its our fault not of pakistan..
    I added this later -
    And similar situation is developing in bengal. How do you plan to deal with that?
    After that pogrom against pandits to change that demographics of the state, the kashmiris are now demanding azaadi. Tomorrow if the same happens in west bengal, should india drop that area off its map too.

    We will end up creating a very dangerous convention regarding such issues.
  • TAR said:

    scorpio50 said:

    @TAR If this is your prescription to deal with the enemy of the nations, we will lose before even making any attempt to fight them off. We gave up SC seat for china, kennedy offered to test a nuclear bomb for us ahead of china in the 60's (we would not be struggling for nsg seat today if that test would have occurred.

    All these efforts to cultivate friendly relations with china have yielded us what exactly?

    you really think its only pakistan behind all this or you think kashmiris are the enemies of the nation..??
    if pakistan is the inspiration for most of them, then let them make their choice..if we have not kept them forcefully with us, then why be afraid of a referendum...they wont vote out.
    believe it or not, kashmir doesnt want to be a part of India and if despite of all our efforts(which most people think the state has made) if we are not able to keep them siding us, then its our fault not of pakistan..
    referendum is risky..because of crowd following..where individuals may not take individual decisions....the atmosphere is not right...i have lived around few kashmiris for sometime.....not everyday wants a separate state, the distrust is mostly based on communal lines, not on political lines..#personalexperience
    wind power α v^3. That's how speed matters to generate power required to drive upsc exam.
  • TAR said:

    why to keep a leg wounded by a scorpion bite (read azaadi ka keeda)..why not get it separated from the body instead..operating it again and again aint working, zeher to badhta hi ja raha hai..
    also, why not give an option of referendum to kashmiris like scotland got..?
    the 1st argument that comes up when kashmir's independence is thought of is that it would create a serious security problem for the plains..so we keep kashmir as a buffer state, just to protect us..??

    Burhan Wani is a sachcha terrorist, killing people indiscriminately even after dying..

    Kashmir will not be the last referendum in that case.

    They'll support those who want independence in Punjab, and then in the North East. How many referendums we will have then?

    What the British failed to achieve, thanks to Sardar, we will do ourselves.
    जो उखाड़ना है उखाड़ लो.
  • UkhaadLo said:

    Etat said:

    Removal is imperative to remove the excuse of throwing stones every Friday evening after a prayer-visit to the local mosque.

    Risking an allegation of oversimplification, I would go out on a limb to say that, AFSPA is the only thing that separates the youth of Kashmir from those of, say, Himachal or MP, all other problems like corruption, unemployment, education (lack of) etc being the same. Some may nitpick of course.

    Peene walon ko peene ka bahana chahiye. After AFSPA, it'll be something else; after that, something else. The issue is proxy war under the garb of a national movement. There's nothing short of handing Kashmir to Pakistan that would stop the stone pelters, not even 'Azaadi.' Even a hypothetical 'Azaad' Kashmiri nation would face similar attacks till they're 'reunited with their brothers in Pakistan.' It's all a Paki game. India shouldn't fall for it. We should stop pussyfooting on stern action against antinationals. Cancer needs surgery.
    Insurgency was at its worst in Punjab, at one time. In 1992-93, new Government came into power and there was a political will to curb militancy. Punjab Police was given free hand under KPS Gill. Within 2 years militancy waned. There were gross Human Rights Violations. It is inevitable. The CM paid price when he was killed by suicide bombers in 1995. But at least normalcy returned.

    Another aspect is that while terrorists were dealt with an iron fist within Punjab, there were covert operations in Pakistan as well, conducted by RAW. There was a tit-for-tat response to every terrorist incident in Punjab. The costs seemed too high to Pakistan to continue this proxy war and eventually they had to reduce their support to terrorism in Punjab.

    Unfortunately, this covert infrastructure of RAW, which took years to build, was dismantled by IK Gujral. Else the RAW agents could have used similar tactics in Pakistan now.
    Perhaps we can still use this strategy, but it will take a lot of time to develop assets.
    Rake up unrest in Baluchistan, and give indirect hint to Pakistan at whose behest is this happening. You trouble Kashmir, we will trouble Baluchistan.

    Pakistan knows only one language. Tit for tat. Bleed them with thousand cuts and they'll stop troubling Kashmir.
    Haha... Are you in RAW and are snooping my PC?? Because a strikingly similar post was drafted by me a few minutes ago only to be abandoned as it was not relevant to a "Faesal vs Wani" thread.

    Btw NSA AD was a part and votary of that dismantled structure you mentioned. Maybe something is being done hush-hush.
    A Lion doesn't concern himself with the opinions of the sheep.
    https://www.facebook.com/jaime.kngslyr.1
    contactjaime123@gmail.com
    twitter @contactjaime123
    My Book https://www.amazon.in/dp/B07B2N695F
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